Have I not been clear about Releases? Please read & respond

[Scott (Boston Padres)]

Hey all. Trading is open which is good. I've seen some teams Outrighting players in hopes of them clearing waivers and falling through to their Minors in order to open up MLB roster spots. That is good too.

I envisioned there would be NO flat out Releases to basically free up salary now that we're in the middle of Free Agency - having just completed RFA and we'll be moving on to UFA later this week. This topic and allowance or not at this time is not specifically in our Constitution. I spoke about it and clarified in my email on February 22nd when I welcomed Ryan to the league, mentioned RFA was complete, and that we'd be opening up trading.

Since that email both Adam (COL RAYS) and Steve (TEX GIANTS) have posted some releases on the board in hopes of freeing up salary. I didn't think we were doing that at this point. Should we? I want to make sure I get whatever is decided into the League Rules. When Andrew and I came up with Off-Season deadlines from December through February back last Fall, there was a deadline to release players - majors or minors. I've even allowed this to continue basically all the way up to before we began RFA bidding a little over a week ago on Feb. 15. Adam states that his releases would have had no bearing on RFA and ultimately make the league more competitive. If I'm speaking correctly for Steve, he believed there'd be one more chance before free agency to release players. Now is not before free agency as we're getting ready for UFA. Everyone would/will be able to release players and free up salary (and eat some of it) after free agency, before the season begins.

What I am looking for is some feedback from the league here. I think that Taylor's been out of town the last couple of days and isn't back until Wednesday or Thursday. Not sure if Andrew's been offline either, but I haven't had any feedback from them about this. Please post your thoughts here. I know Drew and J already have on some of the separate Releases posts.

Thanks. I just want to make sure we get this right for the league overall and then move on to Unrestricted Free Agency as one of the last orders of business before the season begins. RFA is done, and Minors draft is basically complete following Steve's 12th round pick. There may be a couple other picks that come in at this point, but we're through 12 rounds.

[Scott (Boston Padres)]

Everyone please reread through this thread as well. Original date to release players before Free Agency was January 19. We then ok'd it being allowed up until Free Agency was set to begin in February.

diamondduos.proboards.com/thread/678/season-dates-deadlines-2013-2014

[Deleted]

What's the downside to allowing player releases in an attempt to free up salary? Seems like it just allows owners additional roster flexibility, which is a positive. Maybe they held on to a fringe guy, then spent too much during RFAs and need to free up space for the upcoming UFA period. Unless there is a downside here that I am not seeing, I'd support allowing releases (with 25% salary penalty) during this period.

[Deleted]

I'm fine allowing the releases now as well. The issue is everyone needs to be released prior to UFAs going on the board because these released guys would become part of the UFA auction, right?

[Drew (Chicago Blue Jays)]

I am indifferent on this, just want everyone to be on the same page with what the rule is. That being said, part of the risk associated with matching on an RFA is that you have to fit that salary into your budget. That is the reason why it makes some sense to me to limit releases after RFA- if there isn't money for them, don't match the offer.

[Deleted]

Ok but were allowed to go over our budgets by 10M so you know what this really doesn't matter now that I think about it. I'll just take care of the releases before the season starts but I shouldn't have to wait. It would be easier if people could then bid on released players during FA but whatever

[Drew (Chicago Blue Jays)]

Steve I think you are right that it makes some sense to go ahead and get those guys in the pool. Like I said I'm indifferent on this just want to make sure we have it set.

[Scott (Boston Padres)]

So where are we on this? Every team is allowed to go over their cap by 10 million dollars, as long as it is back to under 175 million dollars before the season starts.

If we are going to allow these releases, then these players are definitely eligible for our unrestricted free agent period starting later this week.

[Drew (Chicago Blue Jays)]

Steve traded one of his guys so it looks like he is resigned to the fact that we are going with what we had originally

[Deleted]

I did trade one of them but my opinion on the subject hasn't changed. Being able to release before UFA starts makes sense for all the reasons we are allowing trading

[Deleted]

I'm on the fence with this one, guys. On the one hand, I can certainly understand teams wanting to make moves after RFA but before UFA begins. On the other, after careful review I now understand Commissioners not wanting FA bidding for those outrighted and claimed off waivers to take place either before or during UFA bidding. Like others, I adhered to the original rules and dates with the understanding that outrighting, releasing, and trading players wouldn't be allowed during the FA period.

Whether to free up cap space or open roster spots, the reason for making moves is irrelevant. It's the process itself and concrete dates in question here. I'm fine with majority decision.

To me, the bigger concern heretofore unaddressed is the impact ALL moves will eventually have on the original vision and structure of the league itself. Regardless of the period currently open, whether first-year player draft, RFA, UFA, or in-season, with the volume of moves taking place I can see a point in the not-to-distant-future where rosters won't look anything like original parent franchise organizations. How do I continue under and justify the "KC Marlins" banner when hardly any of my major league roster is composed of players from either organization? Sure, minors rosters are stocked with parent franchise property now, and I'm sure we'll continue to protect parent franchisees, but as players begin to fulfill potential and reach the major leagues there's no doubt aggressive owners will target them. Likewise, underperforming minor league players with no feasible opportunity for major league time will be dumped to make room for the following first-year player draft.

I don't have the "cure-all" solution, and apologize for introducing the idea within this thread. But as long as we're discussing current and future directions for the league we may as well address all owners' concerns. Better to bring these issues up while the league is still in its' infancy to insure all owners' enjoyment for years to come!

[Deleted]

Hey Kirk if you want to have more KC and Mia players then don't trade them away. I'm not being sarcastic it's the truth. Other than that there isn't much more we can do I think with 2 RFA and 1 Franchise tag we have the ability to keep most core players if we want to.

[Drew (Chicago Blue Jays)]

I'm not sure the desire was ever for the teams to continue to look like their parent franchises forever. Some teams (mine and yours included) got rotten starts with teams that were just plain bad. I wouldn't want to pay to be in a league where I had to keep adhering to teams that are not competitive.

[Deleted]

I don't think releasing players is that big of a deal and I don't think it really affects the league that much. What I do think is important is that we stick to the dates and the rules Scott put in place in the future. This league has too many moving parts for them not to be set in stone. I realize this is our first offseason and a lot is up in the air but going forward we need a set of dates that everyone sticks to. I'm certainly not calling anybody out because I think I missed a date or two as well.


This isn't really a poll but my vote is to have a date for all releases prior to RFA and the team is responsible for 25% of the salaries of the players released. Then no more releases until all free agency is over with. Outrighting and trading just moves players from team to team and doesn't affect the pool of players available for bidding, so I think a week of trading after RFA is fine. I think its beneficial for all teams to be able to look at the set in stone list of free agent players that are to be bid on each off season in RFA and normal free agency.

[Deleted]

Good points Taylor but I still think releases should be allowed up until UFA starts and trading should be allowed anytime except for when the trade deadline kicks in till end of season. If we look at this as trying to simulate real baseball there are no restrictions on these types of moves. I insert tans why we can't have teams releasing players during UFA but other than that it should be allowed. I agree that going forward we need to have this stuff firmed up. This issue really doesn't make any diff to me for this season but I think it's the right thing to do for this season and going forward. More than a few teams agree so I'd like to see it put to a vote and be finalized going forward.

[Deleted]

I see what you mean about simulating real baseball. I wouldn't care about the dates of releasing, outrighting, trading at all other than A) there needs to be a specific date when the new season starts so you can release players with a 25% penalty instead of the 50% B) How much work it adds to Scotts plate as hes trying to get ready to organize something as involved as a FA Auction. Im sure it would help the work load if he wasn't having to do all the other stuff. I don't really know why I have the role as a Co-commish but Im pretty sure I suck at it. Haha. Scott and Andrew do the majority of the work around here.

[Scott (Boston Padres)]

Lots to digest here. On one hand I definitely agree with Taylor and think we need to allow releases up until RFA begins, and then close them off until after UFA is complete. We have a $10M overage in cap rule to allow for some wiggle room in bidding and going over the $175M cap.

On the other hand if we move to allow releases prior to RFA, and then again in between RFA and UFA while trading is going on, then why should we even have that $10M overage rule? I don't think one should exist if the other exists.

I appreciate all of your flexibility in this first offseason flurry of moves. I assure you we'll have this more buttoned up prior to next offseason.

Hey Drew, speak for yourself! I for one hope I still have a lot of Red Sox and Padres on my team in the years to come. Heck, I created this league with the idea of the dual franchise, but I can certainly understand how as the years go on, teams will have less and less of their parent franchise teams. Maybe after the first 5 years of the league we look at the lay of the land and come up with a different naming franchise scenario? Or as the years go on maybe we only have to retain a certain number of players from those parent franchises? No worries now. Plenty of time to consider that in the future. In the meantime I'm loving all the logos! (except HOF'er Bobby Cox, c'mon Taylor - something original?)

[Drew (Chicago Blue Jays)]

Haha, it's nice to be able to do that with one of the top franchises in the game. And with the Padres who had a really nice Major/Minor mix when we started.

[Deleted]

Quick hits about the topic before UFA hits tonight. Commissioners have final say but it seems like everyone's leaning towards being fine with it or indifferent.

Deadlines are definitely important to keep the league moving. In this case the deadline was well placed before RFA started and two franchises were late to the game. (I was one of the teams) Either:
1)The teams did it strategically to gain an adv. in RFA
2)Negligence

If 1 is true then we make the teams take back their releases and move forward. No question
If 2 is true then as a league we need to weigh "punishing" those teams vs allowing the releases in light of competitive balance.

In my case I was simply late to the game. I have 35/40 roster spots filled and the releases will allow this season to be more competitive. I believe in deadlines and would be fine with a 50% salary hit as a penalty instead of the 25% as stated in the league rules however I think the releases should stand. It will only add to the player pool and make the league better.

[Deleted]

I'm with sticking to the rules and going on what Scott has said:

This was in my email to the league from early Saturday evening 2/22 at 6:22pm EST.

Also, if you feel you want to Outright a player to waivers in hopes of getting him off your 40-man roster, feel free. You're still on the hook for the salary, and remember, any team can claim within 48 hours and accept the player and contract as is. We are not going to be releasing or dropping any players at this point prior to UFA. Once UFA is complete and we're getting ready to head into the season, you'll be able to release players and be responsible for part of their contract (50% if it's player signed this year, or 25% for any remaining years on a contract from a player that was signed prior to this year).


I think we should certainly open it up for discussion for next offseason, but I felt like Scott addressed it in that email. We had plenty of time to release players before RFA. I think ALL the FA should be locked before RFA begins and continue to be locked until UFA is over. Mainly because that is what the rule was when this season started

[Deleted]

I think it should be put to a vote. As for Adam I would assume just like with being able to go over the salary cap we can also go over max roster size as long as we are compliant before the start of the season. But again that's why we shouldn't have this arbitrary limit on roster moves. As for sticking to deadlines, give me a break we've changed rules and switched deadlines lots of times if it made sense to do it. It's what I respect about this league after this we'll know the rules and plan accordingly going forward

[Scott (Boston Padres)]

Hey all. Go for it. Post a poll and vote. I want to start UFA tomorrow night though, so people better vote quickly. I don't even know what your voting options will be. To be able to drop players at anytime? Before RFA but not during? Before UFA but not during? Get a rule decided by league majority and we'll add it into the Constitution. Let's please figure this out and move on! Thank you.

[Deleted]

No, you guys are the commissioners and you decided against allowing it and that's fine. Lets just move on to UFA and I'll just outright some players to free up roster spots.